Сообщений в теме: 469

[Werebear]

ну допустим пусть будет АП пока, без увеличения силы, потом посмотрим. это всегда можно будет легко исправить

Werebear, что такое "бонус к атаке"??? Где его смотеть???

ну тот самый +2 у двуруча

Сообщение отредактировал Werebear: 02 июня 2012 - 13:57

• 0

Dark Omen Regiments of Renown for Total War: WARHAMMER II member http://steamcommunit.../?id=1312399508

Warhammer Total War (Call of Warhammer) ex-team member
DLV ex-team member
Ник изменен с Isilendil на Werebear

На жаль я не розумію українську мову , прошу використовувати російську або англійську .

• Наверх

[Parmizan]

Werebear, тогда по твоей системе атака:
воин гн = 3+4+1*1 = 8
луч эль = 3+4+1*1 = 8
мародер = 3+4+1*1= 8
воин хаоса = 4+5+1*2 = 11
вампир = 6+5+1*3 = 14

по моей
воин гн = 3+4+4 = 11
луч эль = 3+4+3 = 10
мародер = 3+4+3 = 10
воин хаоса = 4+5+4 = 13
вампир = 6+5+4 = 15

[crisord]

У гномов самое большое лидерство 9,почти ни у кого нет такого за редким исключением...Ещё кол-во атак имеет большое значение, т.е. перс с 3 атаками бьёт три раза в ход и свойство атаковать двумя или тремя рядами тоже имеет большое значение,скакуны тоже наносят дам.некоторые больше седока.Ну и есть персонажи которые могут выдержать несколько ранений, в основном монстры и герои.Ещё хотелось отметить что в вахе наличие командной группы тоже даёт бонусы при подсчёте итогов боя, ну как бы те, у кого знамя или дудка, имеют меньше шансов струсить и убежать.

Сообщение отредактировал crisord: 02 июня 2012 - 14:09

[Werebear]

еще нюанс как быть с маг оружиемрунами и тп.

так как руна может стоить как пол отряда гномов...

На твц был сабмод котоырй пытался тоже самое сделать, может быть там найдем здравые идеи

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As usual with all TW games I had to change some things that IMHO would be better (at least for me) so I've messed a little bit with export_descr_unit.txt and here are the changes I've made (not much but still):

FREE UPKEEP

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- all infantry units are now free upkeep (except infantry bodyguard units) when in cities/castles and the apropriate training buildings are present,
- all artillery that had this attribute lost it,
- cavalry stays the same.

SHOOTING RANGE

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- range of almost 90% of missile and siege units is changed (gowing up or down)
- the amount of missile ammunition is changed (mostly gowing up, but not for the artillery)
- few units' missile attack changed

Range is based on WFB. The longest range in CoW was given to Bolt Throwers (400) so I took the longest range in WFB which goes to Great Cannons, Catapults and Hellcannon (60") and made sth like this (there are however few exceptions for balanced gameplay):
60" - 400
48" - 320
36" - 240
30" - 200
24" - 160
18" - 120
16" - 106
12" - 80
8" - 53
6" - 40
4" - 26

Here are the ranges of missile weapons in WFB with their Strenght values:
Blasting Charges - 4" S6
Throwing Knives/Stars - 6" S user
Throwin Axes - 6" S user+1
Javellins - 8" S user
Pistols - 8" S4AP
Blunderbuss - 12" S5
Flame Cannon - 12" S5
Shortbows - 16" S3
Bows - 24" S3
Repeater Crossbows - 24" S3x2
Handguns - 24" S4AP
Organ/Helblaster - 24"
Longbows - 30" S3
Crossbows - 30" S4
Hochland Handgun - 36" S4AP
Bolts - 48" S6 or S4
Mortar - 48" S3(s6)
Cannon - 48" S10
Helstorm - 48" S5
Hellcannon - 60" S10
Great Cannon - 60" S10
Catapult - 60" S4(S8)

Here are the units before the change (name - attack value, range, ammo, what the unit uses in WFB):
Horrors - 20, 110, 50 first spell from Tzeentch Lore
Netters - 1, 30, 1
Plagueberrers - 1, 60, 1
Miners - 50 (40), 60, 5 (3) blasting charges
Kvassnics - 25, 60, 4 throwing acid
Marauders - 15, 65, 6 throwing axes
Pistoliers - 10, 110, 12 pistol
Longdrong - 11, 120, 12 pistol
Bandolleros Bodyguard - 10, 120, 12, pistol
Mounted Marauders - 11, 80, 6 javelins
Chaos Dwarfs - 5, 80, 10 blunderbuss
Goblin Arrerz - 2, 160, 30 shortbow
Night Goblin Arrerz - 2, 180, 30 shortbow
Night Goblins Squig Bodyguards - 6, 170, 30 shortbow
Wolf Riders - 5, 150, 30 shortbow
Chekists - 11, 130, 16 short handgun
Handgunners - 13, 150, 12 handgun
Streltsy - 13, 150, 12 handgun
Thunderers - 14, 155, 12 handgun
Bandolleros - 10 (12), 120 (160), 12 slightly longer handgun
Ellyrian Reavers - 7, 170, 30 bow
Lothern Archers - 8, 230, 30 bow
Shadow Warriors - 8, 230, 30 bow
Free Company - 8, 200, 30 bow
Orc Arrez Rebels - 7, 170, 30 bow
Ungol - 7, 170, 30 bow
Orc Arrerz - 7, 170, 30 bow
Savage Orcs Arrerz - 8, 180, 30 bow
Border Princes Bowmen - 7, 190, 30 bow
Skeleton Archers - 7, 180, 30 bow
Archers - 7, 190, 30 bow
Dark Elf Repeater - 7, 130, 30 repeater crossbow
Shadows - 8, 145, 40 repeater crossbow
Rangers - 10, 185, 25 crossbow
Quarrellers - 10, 175, 25 crossbow
Armoured Orcs - 9, 180, 30 (25) crossbow
Lost Legion - 9, 170, 25 crossbow
Tilean Crossbows - 9, 170, 25 crossbow
Miragliano - 10 (9), 180 (175), 30 (25) crossbow
Besiegers - 10, 190, 55 crossbow
Crossbowmen - 9, 170, 25 crossbow
Nordland Crossbows - 10, 190, 25 crossbow
Stir River - 8, 230, 30 longbow
Kossars - 7, 190, 30 longbow
High Elf Archers - 7, 190, 30 longbow
Hochland - 14, 200, 12 hochland handgun

Flame Cannon - 25, 140, 50
Helblaster - 40, 270, 200
Organ Gun - 37, 250, 150
Reaper Bolt Thrower - 20, 400, 50 bolt
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 20, 400, 50 bolt
Chukka - 20, 400, 50 bolt
Bolt Thrower - 20, 400, 50 bolt
Dwarf Cannon - 70, 300, 20 cannon
Bronzino - 25, 275, 25 cannon
Helstorm - 5, 210, 100
Uragan - 50, 300, 20 mortar
Dwarf Mortar - 70, 365, 20 mortar (which Dwarfs don't use actually)
Mortar - 50, 365, 20 mortar
Cannon - 50, 330, 20 great cannon
Nuln Cannon - 70, 350, 20 great cannon
Helcannon - 50, 275, 20
Skull Catapult - 50, 280, 20 catapult
Rock Lobba - 40, 300, 20 catapult
Grudge Thrower - 40, 275, 20 catapult

And here are after the changes:

Netters - 1, 40, 1
Plagueberrers - 1, 40, 1
Miners - 45, 40, 4 blasting charges
Kvassnics - 25, 50, 4 throwing acid
Marauders - 15, 50, 6 throwing axes
Pistoliers - 10, 70, 20 pistol
Longdrong - 11, 70, 20 pistol
Bandolleros Bodyguard - 10, 70, 20, pistol
Mounted Marauders - 11, 70, 6 javelins
Chaos Dwarfs - 8, 80, 20 blunderbuss
Goblin Arrerz - 3, 110, 30 shortbow
Night Goblin Arrerz - 3, 110, 30 shortbow
Night Goblins Squig Bodyguards - 6, 110, 30 shortbow
Wolf Riders - 5, 110, 30 shortbow
Horrors - 20, 120, 50 first spell from Tzeentch Lore
Chekists - 11, 130, 20 shorthandgun
Handgunners - 13, 160, 20 handgun
Streltsy - 13, 160, 20 handguns
Thunderers - 14, 170, 25 handgun
Bandolleros - 12, 165, 20 slightly longer handgun
Ellyrian Reavers - 7, 160, 35 bow
Lothern Archers - 8, 170, 35 bow
Shadow Warriors - 8, 170, 35 bow
Free Company - 7, 160, 30 bow
Orc Arrez Rebels - 7, 160, 30 bow
Ungol - 7, 150, 30 bow
Orc Arrerz - 7, 160, 30 bow
Savage Orcs Arrerz - 8, 160, 30 bow
Border Princes Bowmen - 7, 160, 30 bow
Skeleton Archers - 7, 160, 30 bow
Archers - 8, 160, 30 bow
Dark Elf Repeater - 7, 160, 35 repeater crossbow
Shadows - 8, 160, 35 repeater crossbow
Rangers - 10, 200, 35 crossbow
Quarrellers - 10, 200, 30 crossbow
Armoured Orcs - 9, 200, 30 crossbow
Lost Legion - 9, 200, 30 crossbow
Tilean Crossbows - 9, 200, 30 crossbow
Miragliano - 10, 200, 30 crossbow
Besiegers - 10, 200, 40 crossbow
Crossbowmen - 9, 200, 30 crossbow
Nordland Crossbows - 10, 200, 30 crossbow
Stir River - 8, 200, 30 longbow
Kossars - 7, 200, 30 longbow
High Elf Archers - 8, 210, 30 longbow
Hochland - 13, 240, 20 hochland handgun

Flame Cannon - 25, 140, 50
Helblaster - 40, 160, 200
Organ Gun - 40, 160, 150
Reaper Bolt Thrower - 20, 340, 50 bolt
Repeater Bolt Thrower - 20, 340, 50 bolt
Chukka - 20, 320, 50 bolt
Bolt Thrower - 30, 300, 50 bolt
Dwarf Cannon - 70, 320, 20 cannon
Bronzino - 25, 300, 25 cannon
Helstorm - 5, 320, 100
Uragan - 35, 320, 20 mortar
Dwarf Mortar - 50, 320, 20 mortar
Mortar - 35, 320, 20 mortar
Cannon - 50, 400, 20 great cannon
Nuln Cannon - 70, 400, 20 great cannon
Helcannon - 50, 400, 20
Skull Catapult - 40, 320, 20 catapult
Rock Lobba - 40, 320, 20 catapult
Grudge Thrower - 40, 320, 20 catapult

DEFENCE

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- all units have new defence values based on WFB rules (of course I had to make some adjustments so that the changes would be more balanced)
- armour is based on what kind of armour the unit is wearing, does it fight on mounts, does it have some special ward saves etc,
- defence skill is based on Weapon Skill from TT, and in few exceptions (Daemonic units or slayers) is bigger so the units can be more resiliant, plus Mark of Nurgle also goes in here. Bodyguard units have WS of Lords or Special Characters from TT,
- shield is based on...shield .
- Nurgle Warriors have 2HP
- Daemons have 2HP/3HP/4HP
- Daemon Prince has 6HP
- all Wizards have HP based on Lords from TT
To diverse the factions I gave such bonuses:
- Dwarfs and Dark Elves have increased Defence Skill by 2 for their long living and war experience
- High Elves have increased Defence Skill by 3 - long living and ASF special rule from TT (didn't know how to represent this, if it won't work I'll change it)
- Chaos Warriors Defence Skill increased by 1
- Vampires Defence Skill raised by 2 (Blood Dragons on foot and mounted)

These are the values I based on:
None - 0
Daemonic Aura - 1 to to armour
Mark of Tzeentch - 1 to to armour
Mark of Nurgle - 1 to to WS
Leather Armour - 2 to armour
Talismanic Tatoos - 2 to to armour (Savage Orcs, Troll Slayers)
Light Armour - 4 to armour
Heavy Armour - 6 to armour
Plate Armour, Dragon Armour - 8 to armour (i.ex Bretonnian knights)
Full Plate Armour, Gromril Armour, Chaos Armour - 10 to armour (only available for Empire, Dwarfs, Chaos and Blood Dragons)
Horse - 1 to armour
Horse with Barding - 2 to armour
Small Shield - 1 to shield
Medium Shield - 2 to shield
Large Shield - 3 to shield
Very Large Shield - 4 to shield
Huge Shield - 5 to shield
Pavise - 6 to shield (only one unit uses those - Braganza Besiegers)

The biggest defence value is 25 (Champion Knights of Chaos Undivided)

MORALE

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- redone completely, no more morale value of 36
- the biggest morale value is for Slaanesh Warriors and Knights (immune to Fear and Terror and Panic) and is 20 for Bodyguard unit
- Champion Knights of Chaos Undivided also have morale 20
- I've tried to make this as fair as possible and of course base it on TT, i.ex Ld 8 for Empire Knights is 14 (16 for bodyguard units),
- lock_morale is only on Sylvanian army and units that are unbreakable in TT (Slayers).

ATTRIBUTES

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- all cavalry units, Daemons, Dwarfs, Undead, Beasts, Black Orcs, Big Uns, Armoured Orcs and Trolls are very_hardy,
- High Elves, Dark Elves, Chaos infantry, Orcs and few elite units are hardy,
- command is only on bodyguard units plus Longbeards,
- frightened foot and mounted given to all Undead units, bear cavalry, Morr Knights, Cold One Knights, Daemons, Chaos cavalry, Gryphon Legion, Phoenix Guards, Black Guard,

UNIT SIZE

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These are rough estimates, I don't remember all the exact numbers. Please, bear in mind that in some cases the differences given here and what you will see in the game can be big (so many changes here).


CHAOS:
- marauders on foot 151 men
- marauders horse 50
- warriors on foot 112
- knights 50
- warriors chosen 101
- knights chosen 37
- knights bodyguards 15
- daemons - 75
- gors/ungors 187
- bestigors 125

EMPIRE:
- core line troops 152
- core specialized troops 125
- special troops 102
- hochland marksmen - 77
- cavalry 62 (Reiksguard better morale, Morr frightens enemies, Panthers faster, Suns better armour)

DARK/HIGH ELVES:
- core troops 125
- special units 112
- cavalry 50
- Dragon Princes/Cold One Knights 37

DWARFS:
- all units 112

ORCS:
- Big Uns 112
- Black Orcs 101
- Savage Orcs 112
- Armoured Orcs 112
- rest will stay the same

GOBLINS:
- nothing will be changed

KISLEV:
- Halberdiers/Spearmen/Cossars 150
- special troops 102

SYLVANIA:
- skeletons 187
- grave guard 101
- blood dragons foot 75
- blood dragons mounted 30
- black knights 62
- rest the same

BRETONNIA:
- stays the same.

ATTACK VALUES

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- based on TT rules for HtH weapons i.ex spear for cavalry gives +1 to attack, a lance +2 to attack, etc
- to make the changes I combined TT Strength of the unit x2 plus its Attacks (there are few exceptions when I added also WS like for the Daemon Prince) so Reiksguard on Foot would be 9 (4x2 +1), Greatswords would be 11 (5x2 +1) because they are using GW etc
- of course I had to use some balance and Orcs, Dwarfs, Vampires and Chaos have been given a minor boost to their attack values - some of them bigger, some of them smaller. As I've said it's difficult to simply copy/paste everything from a TT game to a PC game and have 100% balance,
- Halberd units have light_spear, spear_bonus_4 attributes
- Spear units have spear, sprear_bonus_4 attribute (with the exception of wild orcs and skeletons)
- Pike units have only their pikes to fight, I've removed their swords and they have bigger spear bonus. So now they are cavalry and to some degree infantry butchers when attacked from the front but are butchered themselves when attacked from the rear/back

ADDITIONAL STUFF

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- export descr buidling - I've made quite a lot of changes there to cost and building time and bonuses
- descr projectiles - I've changed the projectiles for crossbows so that they can fire properly during siege battles when you place them on walls
- descr cultures - not much really, just the watchtower cost is now 20
- desc area effects - boiling oil work as it should be burning all that goes near the gate

I think that is all. Hope you will like those changes. The biggest problem is that WFB isn't perfect with its rules and it is quite difficult to make it working here. So, please be gentle with me I'm still working on upkeep costs.




To use it download the files and copy/paste them to your game data folder. Be sure to make a back-up copy just in case. Changes are save-game compatible (but some of them will be visible only after you start a new campaign).

Werebear, тогда по твоей системе атака:
воин гн = 3+4+1*1 = 8
луч эль = 3+4+1*1 = 8
мародер = 3+4+1*1= 8
воин хаоса = 4+5+1*2 = 11
вампир = 6+5+1*3 = 14

мне не оч нравится, так как бонус от оруджия становится ничтожным. если в настолке это 10-40% к одному показателю, то тут копейки


наверное надо бонус от оружия умножать на 3

Сообщение отредактировал Werebear: 02 июня 2012 - 14:21

• 0

Dark Omen Regiments of Renown for Total War: WARHAMMER II member http://steamcommunit.../?id=1312399508

Warhammer Total War (Call of Warhammer) ex-team member
DLV ex-team member
Ник изменен с Isilendil на Werebear

На жаль я не розумію українську мову , прошу використовувати російську або англійську .

• Наверх

[crisord]

Руны могут брать далеко не все.И есть выбор брать или нет.Это реализовать не получится...Кажется в основном герои могут брать руны( предметы с рунами)... Если только нанять отряд воинов гномов, нанять отряд воинов гномов( тех же самых )но в трусах счастья+ столько то атаки,нанять отряд воинов гномов( тех же самых) но с палкой-убивалкой,+5 атаки.... 

Сообщение отредактировал crisord: 02 июня 2012 - 14:34

[Parmizan]

Werebear, тогда этот присловутый "бонус от оружия" и есть тип оружия который я предлагал изначально.
Т.е. твоя формула А=с+во+б*ка
б (бонус) можно поставить так:
меч - 2
топор - 3
молот\булава - 3
копье - 2
пика - 1
двуруч меч - 5
двуруч топор - 6
двуруч молот - 6
и т.п.
или так:
одноручное - 2
копейное - 1
двуручное - 6
магическое - 8...

crisord, что такое лидерство??? Чем это может быть в моде??? Моралью???

Сообщение отредактировал Parmizan: 02 июня 2012 - 14:45

[crisord]

Кстати у больших мечей по правилам бронебойность,двуручное оружие бьют последними.Parmizan: Да, храбрость, стойкость.По оружию там кажется ещё парное должно быть...и кавалерийское копьё ланс 

Сообщение отредактировал crisord: 02 июня 2012 - 14:54

[Magnus]

копье - 2пика - 1

А почему у пики бонус меньше? Пика более технически совершенное оружие.

[Parmizan]

Magnus, из-за анимации, по хорошему пикам нужно -5,-6 к атаке ибо пика это чит, во всяком случае в ТА.

[Magnus]

Parmizan,
Чит, не чит, а фаерболом разваливает пикинеров аж бегом. Или орочьей магией. Она вообще снайперская